Questions and CONVINCE ME!

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  • 2Corin57
    Participant

    For starters: convince me – convince me that this way works, this way that is so far outside the box of workbooks and several pages of circling answers and filling in blanks and 60 minute long language arts lessons. Convince me that at 8, he doesn’t need a science curriculum, that nature study is enough. Convince me that he doesn’t need an intense language arts program. Convince me that narration is enough -that we don’t need tests and worksheets to prove that he’s learning. Convince me that at 5 my daughter doesn’t need to be learning phonics and how to read and do addition and subtraction and I don’t need to force her to sit and do handwriting lessons when they make her upset.

    And then talk to me about math. He has always struggled with math, it’s his least favorite subject and while he’s actually pretty good at it, it really stresses him out (he also has SPD, Tourette Syndrome which leads to some anxiety). We’re currently using CLE which actually has been the best program we’ve come across yet – but it takes sooo long, lessons are often 6 pages long, plus flashcard and speed drills. And while it’s helping him, at the same time, math lessons alone are taking us up to an hour to complete, which means we normally end up skipping other stuff like science, history, french etc…  I’ve thought of just doing half a lesson at a time, but… he’ll get so far behind as it’ll take forever to complete a grade. Thoughts?

    Tristan
    Participant

    It is enough.  It is okay to wait, to give them time to be children and to mature.  Think about it this way – you CAN teach a baby or toddler to read.  I’ve seen it done.  It’s a whole lot of work and their understanding lags far behind their ability to sight read words.  OR you can wait until a child is 5 or 6.  It is still a lot of work.  But easier than teaching a toddler to read.  OR you can wait until a child is ready (whatever age that may be, and it will vary) and they will learn to read in a short time with consistent practice.  Why?  Because they are developmentally ready.  I have had kids all over the place in learning to read (and I’m working with child #5 of 9 currently).  This example is even more true for abstract concepts like grammar!  Yes, a child can memorize the definition of a verb, noun, pronoun, adjective, etc.  But they are just parroting back to you what they memorized, there is not a deep understanding.  So why waste your time and theirs?  Traditional grammar curricula teaches the same basic concepts over and over and over for 10-12 grades, adding a tiny bit new each year, but mostly reviewing the same basics.  Why not wait until a child is old enough to study grammar and grasp it well?  Imagine how much easier a 10 or 14 year old would grasp concepts.  You wouldn’t need to repeat the same topics year after year after year (after year…).  It works!

     

    For science – it’s okay to let your child explore topics they are interested in!  If that is space, or robots, or chemical reactions then go for it.  But kids are concrete.  Nature is hands on, see-able, touch-able.  It is concrete! So it is a wonderful place to start and there is so much to study and explore in nature that you could easily stick with that for years and not run out of new things to learn about.  I happen to study other science topics too with my kids that are 8 and under – like their bodies, and building things!  Most of my kids love nature study and hands on concrete things like studying the human body and building things.  A few have asked on occasion for more science and I’ve obliged those children.

    Math is the boogey man for so many of us!  Will rushing and pushing through the curriculum that is working help him UNDERSTAND and grasp the concepts well, to master them?  No.  And really, you want him to truly master these basics because everything else is easier and faster when you don’t need to use your fingers to figure out basic addition, subtraction, etc.  So give him time to go at his pace.  If you really want to finish one lesson in a day consider breaking it up into two sessions – that is okay to do if he’ll let you sit him down for math twice a day.  But my guess is he won’t be thrilled with that idea.  😉  Consider not taking a break from math during the summer – but keep half length lessons going and over a few years time he’ll actually end up ahead.  I started my oldest over at the very beginning with math in 3rd grade.  We went back to kindergarten/1st grade concepts after taking 6 months of a complete break from all math.  We just kept plugging along during all seasons at math and she ‘caught up’ without stressing about hurrying through over the course of a few years.  She’s a 9th grader now doing Algebra 1 just fine.  Math isn’t her best subject, she doesn’t love it, but she can do it without tears and feels a sense of accomplishment when she ‘does hard things’.

    ((HUGS)) It is such a jump of the beaten path at first to slow down to your child’s pace.  But it is so worth it!

     

    2Corin57
    Participant

    Thank you. I at one time owned Math on the Level, and I really loved how I could really personalize it to his level. But… it was more work to put together. He’s actually not minding CLE that badly – except that lessons are long, and right now he’s really struggling with the concept of money, and it’s stressing him out.

    For LA – we’re using CLE for that too, and don’t get me wrong it’s a great program, but… sometimes I wonder why we’re using it. He has an extremely visual memory, so he sees the spelling words once and knows them. He doesn’t need the phonics, he’s an extremely advanced reader. And the grammar concepts are largely review for him, too. So.. why am I sitting my son down to spend 30 minutes working through stuff he already knows? What I’ve considered doing is slowly starting to work through the old Harvey’s Grammar, orally, just a few minutes a day.

    The reading program is nice, but… do we really need a workbook program for reading comprehension? More and more I’m thinking that just sitting down with a book to read together, narrating it and discussing it are enough. But then, I worry that he’ll miss out on all these critical thinking skills like comprehension, inference, analyzing, discerning etc…

    2Corin57
    Participant

    And for science, what I would really love to do is just read about what he’s interested in. If he wants to read about space for a few days we will, or all the animals of the world (which is what he’d really like to do, lol)… then so be it. Read living books, watch documentaries, do experiments where applicable etc

    2Corin57
    Participant

    The one thing we recently started that we’re both loving is Story of the World.

    sheraz
    Participant

    More and more I’m thinking that just sitting down with a book to read together, narrating it and discussing it are enough. But then, I worry that he’ll miss out on all these critical thinking skills like comprehension, inference, analyzing, discerning etc…

    Narration covers all of that and more. If your son cannot narrate the material and he is listening/paying attention, then he probably is not comprehending it. However, if he can tell you a few things about the reading, whether or not the character made good choices and why or why not, how he would’ve handled  the situation, – I would say that he IS covering all those critical thinking areas.  There are some many ways to get a narration and all of them will build those skills.

    My CM discussion group recently discussed narration and one of the ladies shared five questions that she uses to help get those skills going that she got from the Teaching From Rest website/book/Reading Aloud Revival. They included:

    1. How is X like Y?

    2. How is X different from Y?

    3. What other story does this remind you of?

    4. What do you think about what he did? Should he have done that?

    5. Who was the most _______ in the story?  (Scary, brave, etc.)

    6. What would you have done in his place?

    Don’t moralize in these discussions – instead narrate with him and you will enjoy these conversations and learn to “deep-down” trust the methods.

    Wings2fly
    Participant

    Read this thread about language arts and drop CLE (except their math):

    https://simplycharlottemason.com/scmforum/topic/writing-advice/

    For science you have the right idea.  Just do it.  Here are some topics to read further :

    https://simplycharlottemason.com/scmforum/topic/elementary-science/

    We use CLE math and have only 4 pages per lesson at 300 & 400 levels.  You can split it into two math sessions instead of one long session.  Read more here:

    https://simplycharlottemason.com/scmforum/topic/length-of-math-lessons/

    bethanna
    Participant

    Some reading has been suggested, but have you ever read the book For The Children’s Sake? The author’s name escapes me at the moment. That was the book that convinced me! I had been a public school teacher for seven years. When expecting our first child, we made the decision to homeschool. Based on my experiences, I knew what I did NOT want to do, but I really had no idea that there was another way other than the school-at-home approach. I started researching and came across brief explanations of CM philosophy/methods, but when I found For The Children’s Sake at a public library lightbulbs went off. I knew this was IT! 🙂

    Melanie32
    Participant

    The author of For the Children’s Sake is Susan Schaeffer MaCauley. 🙂

    I agree that you should read a good book on Charlotte Mason and her methods. When I first began reading about her methods years ago, they resonated with me. Right away I knew this was the way I wanted to educate my children. It just made sense.

    I have been implementing Charlotte’s principles in my homeschool for 13 years now and couldn’t be more pleased with the results! I wish I had been taught this way! It’s been a wonderful experience to learn alongside my children.

    I recommend watching Simply Charlotte Mason’s free video on the Five Flavors of Homeschooling to see if CM is the right fit for your family.

    Melanie32
    Participant

    I also recommend Charlotte Mason’s 6th volume-A Philosophy of Education. Karen Glass (a long time CM homeschooler) has modernized it and made it more accessible to modern day readers. Its called Mind to Mind.

    Charlotte’s books are available to read free online through Amblesideonline.

    Melissa
    Participant

    I’ll try to convince you by sharing my own experience of what convinced me. 🙂

    I read A Charlotte Mason Companion by Karen Andreola (the purple book) and it completely relaxed me after thinking I’d made a huge mistake (we had switched to hsing after my kids had already been in a private, Christian school–the oldest through sixth grade). I also read 10 Secrets to the Best Education for Your Child by Kevin Swanson. I also read up on the Common Core and listened to a two-hour youtube video of Duke Pesta giving his spiel. Now I am at the point where I truly believe that if ALL I had were a Bible and an encyclopedia that I still would homeschool my kids.

    Using the CM method is, of course, one of numerous ways to home educate our kids. I think it’s the best thing going or I wouldn’t be doing it. What are those two CM quotes? One about a hammock–with regard to gaps? And then the one about it being more about how much the child cares than how much he knows? I really am coming to believe these things because I see it in my kids and I see it in myself.

    I’m sure that there are easier ways to homeschool but I get excited about this way! I really LIKE it even though it’s hard. And it is so sweet and enjoyable to take a minute and read a poem or turn on a Bach CD or see my kids quietly sketching in their nature notebooks. I feel like they get to be kids and, to tell you the truth, I am learning more now than I ever have because I care more than I ever did.

    Your kids are 8 and 5? How wonderful! I wish I had started back when mine were so small. 🙂 Our kids are 13, 11, 9, 6, 4 and 2.

    I hope that you find what works well for your family. I think that if YOU like the method, then that will be reflected in your time w your children and the tone of your home will be more joyful than stressful. I tend to get stressed bc I have to tend to so many physical needs of my little ones while wanting to make sure that the older ones are learning. I had to find something that I liked doing or we would all be miserable.

    Read that Swanson book. It’s a quick read. So many great points in there about how character training is more important than algebra, geometry and Latin (see the book of Proverbs).

    I am finding that this forum is a great place to find support, too!

     

     

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