New here, with Chronicles question.

Tara – Just wanted to say that I’m so glad you shared in such great detail.  It is really encouraging to me, because I find myself being lead to be cautious in what my children consume, but it really is quite a lot of work sometimes because it’s so much easier to “go with the flow”.  I appreciated all of the information about Lewis because while I have read many of his books both for children and adults, as a child and while in college, there was something that just seemed unsettling to me and caused me to have the same questions about whether or not – for me – they actually WERE edifying.  At the time I thought nothing of it and just accepted it all because it was written by a Christian, but looking back I have questions.  It’s so very easy to just read them because everyone else is, or to just accept that CS Lewis was a Christian or even beyond that he had a view of scripture and Christ that is accurate, because “all” Christians say he was/did.  I don’t think I will banish all CS Lewis from my home, but I do SO appreciate this discussion because I think that it will lead me to be more cautious if we get to the point when we do read his works someday. 

I think oftentimes I as a Christian am less concerned with allowing my children to consume things labeled as Christian and don’t scrutinize it even though it might be presenting a false gospel or works based theology that really isn’t scripturally accurate – I have taken for granted that just because it is labeled Christian it must be “good”.  This even reminds me of the veggietales thread from not too long ago. 

Is it possible to preview EVERY piece of literature our children read? – most likely not.  BUT I’d hate to just hand my child something and tell them – it’s written by a Christian so it’s ok, without warning them to be critical of it should they come across something that contradicts what they understand to be from the word of God – in fact, I’d love to get them to the point as they’re older that they are even scrutinizing the Bible and asking questions of scripture that seem to “contradict” other passages.  Let’s not just read it and say, well, the Bible contradicts itself and so assume that the Bible is NOT inerrant, let’s read the Word and ask questions and discuss and figure out to the best of our ability why God wanted us to have both of these passages and why they are TRUE and do NOT contradict each other, but of course that is a lot of work and sometimes takes prayer and time to work through and after all so many Christians just can’t be bothered with that. 

Ultimately, for parents who DO have a question about why they might allow their children to read Narnia, but not Potter, I’d say it’s quite possibily the Holy Spirit working on their individual conscience and that to just go ahead and read them because everyone else is would probably be … dare I say it… a SIN for THEM, now if they weigh the pro and cons based on the information they are able to find and if after PRAYER and application of scripture they determine that they can allow their children to read it without feelings of guilt then it’s likely not an act of disobedience.  Just as for ME it would be a sin NOT to homeschool – sending my children away from me for schooling would be in direct disobedience to what I KNOW Christ has called me to do, but I do not believe that EVERY Christian who sends their child away to school is sinning, I just accept the fact that it’s possible… ok likely, that God has called other people to send their children to school, just as he’s called me to keep mine home.  I think the problem lies in the things we do out of reflex, rather than out of prayerful consideration.  As a homeschooler, doesn’t it drive you crazy when other Christians just automatically say, “Oh I could NEVER homeschool”, even though you KNOW they have never truly considered it or prayed about it.  Definitely, a whole OTHER subject.

Just wanted to write because it seemed like there’s lots of support out there for reading Lewis and the benefits people have experienced, but for me… I was challenged by what Tara shared, because that’s more where I feel the Holy Spirit at work in my life and hearing that there are others who are similarly convicted to remove things from their lives that could be a stumbling block to them or their children is encouraging to me (though probably not very popular).

Rebekah

Thanks for all the posts here, it’s been an interesting discussion!  I must say I’m very shocked to read the Keepers scathing review of Lewis.  I think they have wonderful hearts, but weak theology.  C.S. Lewis is considered by learned, conservative theologians to be one of the greatest apologists of all time.  I’m sad to read their statement, will need to reconsider using their materials now.  Thank you for sharing it, I had never been to that section on their site.

I heartily agree that this is a personal decision that we are privileged as parents to make for our families as we see fit and should not judge one another’s choices.  For anyone still debating this issue for their own family, I just wanted to add that my kids have watched Narnia (will be reading next school year), watched Lord of the Rings, read fairy tales, Greek Myth’s, watched the Wizard of Oz, know about Darwin, etc. and it has in no shape or form harmed their faith.  They know that the Bible is Truth and these things are just stories and find it silly that some people actually believed in these things.

I believe that as long as we are raising our kids in the Truth and teaching them the WHY’s of their faith, these issues will not harm them.  I heard Josh McDowell speak and the statistics were shocking as to how many kids raised in Christian homes leave the faith once on their own—and I don’t think homeschoolers are exempt.  He related it to their lack of ability to critique other’s ideas and defend their faith and the inerrancy of the Bible.  As soon as they hit the world of work or college (even many Christian colleges have liberal professors), they can easiy be swayed if they don’t know WHY they believe what they believe—besides mom and dad said so. 

I just think that raising these issues in the safety of our homes is the best place, before they are confronted with friends and professors who can easily sway them wrongly.  McDowell has great materials for providing this background, even to elementary aged kids. 

My husband is an assoc. pastor at a large Christian church.  Because of his lenghthy theology studies he is called the ‘doctrinal gatekeeper’ to the church staff:)  Because of his influence, I’ve come to realize how much I still need to learn about doctrine and right theology.  In the past, I’ve often gone by my feelings of what’s right and wrong, or a certain legalistic church’s traditions that aren’t based on Truth, etc.  We have freedom in Christ, I’m thankful for that!

Blessings to you all:)  Gina

@ Misty – I do not think that you are a bad mother for allowing the movies that you have mentioned. My husband and I have seen them and will allow our children to view them when a bit older, they are a bit young yet for the movie versions of Narnia. (Besides we always like the book better and read it first before seeing the movie version.)

@Tara – I agree with Linda (Missingtheshire); there is no need to offer apology for sharing your opinion or point of view. I am not offended by your comments or the KotF quotes in the least; I simply disagree and felt it necessary to point out that we are to exercise our own discernment and not just accept what another person or organization (myself, included) says at face value.

It is wise for all of us to consider carefully our consumption of any media. What works for us is to set aside a Family Pizza & a Movie Night once per week, but I don’t presume that our plan will work for everyone. Each family must search the Word and determine what meets their standards based upon their convictions from the Lord. It is good that your family has done so, as have many on this forum – yet, all of us may have different standards based upon those convictions.

In regards to separating ourselves from the world, let’s not forget that we are still in the world and if we are to reach the lost for Jesus, we need to be engaged with those around us that are in the world and of the world. Jesus’ spent relational time with the 12 disciples, His most intimate friends, if you will, but they did not spend all of their time apart from the world. They went into the world and engaged society right where they were, steeped in sin. By way of example… Consider the story of the Auca Indians of South America. How would one reach a murderous tribe, removed from civilization, that greeted outsiders with death at the end of a spear, by being separate? This was the situation that faced Nate Saint, Jim Elliot, and 3 others when they sought to reach the Auca Indians for Christ. They walked into the lion’s den, so to speak, for the sake of Jesus and as a result a whole people group has come to a saving faith. These men were willing to be in the midst sinners, if it meant winning them for Christ. We can do no less. The apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 9:19-23 said,

For though I am free from all men, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win the more; 20 and to the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might win Jews; to those who areunder the law, as under the law, that I might win those who are under the law; 21 to those who are without law, as without law (not being without law toward God, but under law toward Christ, that I might win those who are without law;22 to the weak I became as weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. 23 Now this I do for the gospel’s sake, that I may be partaker of it with you.

Blessings,

Christie 

“As for Lewis, he believed men evolved from animals, held that the Biblical Genesis account came from pagan and mythical sources, that pagans could be saved w/o knowing it, believed in works salvation, and so on. He wrote things that blatantly contradict scripture. I don’t want that influencing my children.”

Tara, could you send me some supporting information on this(besides Keepers)?  I did find a website making these sorts of accusations, but the author was also criticizing Lewis for smoking a pipe and visiting pubs—-abslolutely not sinful acts.  This same author also criticized the Narnia film and Lewis’ character of Mr. Tumnus, relating him to Pan and saying the scene where he took young Lucy into his house was pedophilia!  I saw that scene and did not get any hint of that at all.  Absolutely not. The author was definately an alarmist and not someone whose opinions I could trust.

I would honestly like to know a reliable, theologically respected source who says these things and make sure his writings are not being taken out of context by those criticizing him. Honestly, I have a hard time understanding him sometimes myself!  Thanks for any help with this:)   Gina

Well, I was finally able to go to KOF and look at the write up about C.S. Lewis. I tried not to pre-judge what I thought I would find, but alas, I am human. Where to start, first, it is very clear to me that the folks behind the website are trying to do what they feel God has called them to do. Second, to me there is no issues with a family deciding what or what not to bring into their family for reading, watching, or listening.

it is sad that so many things were taken out of context about Lewis’ writing that I simply do not have the time to go through it here. The condescension that I see in the reviewer’s writing was a little beyond the pale. He or she is essentially saying “look, I know that you have been told that Lewis was great, but I have more insight than you.” Okay, they did not say that exactly, but as someone who has read most of Lewis’ writing, I find it puzzling that most, if not all, theologians at Dallas Theological Seminary, Gordon Conwell, Wheaton, Moody, etc… have not figured out what KOF supposedly has. Yes, I am being a little sarcastic, but my point is that before you believe everything that someone says (me included), read and study it for yourself. Why is it okay for the reviewer at KOF to read it and give their opinion, but then not for me to read it because they say it is heresy? It’s very similar to movie reviewers. They say “I have watched this movie and it has a weak story-line, bad acting, and no action.” Then I see it and find out, “wait, I thought this was supposed to be a bad movie; I thought it was pretty good.” I am not saying that everything that KOF said or alluded to I found issue with, I didn’t. What I find issue with is the intent. The writing was not edifying, nor was it accurate. 

Suffice to say, I can take ANY book, fiction or non-fiction, have an agenda, and make my point for or against pretty much anything. (read Eccl 10:14 and don’t look at the context and see what I mean). It does not bother me one way or another if someone chooses whether or not to read Lewis. My concern is that someone is reading what KOF (or anyone else) is saying concerning what his writing may or may not say. The simple answer is, read it yourself, in whole, in context.

Yes, Lewis became an Anglican. And yes, I have many issues with the Anglican Church. But, I know a number of Anglicans that are God fearing, Bible believing, born again Christians. Less I digress, the real issue here is that much of what I read on the KOF review was taken out of context and was simply the writer’s opinion. This is exactly what I have seen in the world with the argument against Scripture. How many times have you heard “the Bible is full of murder, lies, infanticide, torture, etc.?”   I have heard that all my life. The simple answer is YES, the Bible is full of those things, but if you don’t read the whole thing, you will never understand the fullness of God’s grace and mercy.

Just my 2 cents…

I’m at the end of The Horse and His Boy and I’m just not getting what I guess I’m supposed to be getting from whatever they’re (KOF) suggesting is there.  Even if Lewis had meant for it to be more than it is, it’s not anymore than a good book to me.  And, I wouldn’t even say it has been the best series I’ve ever read, but definitely good. I plan to finish the whole series eventually. 

I was going to mention another couple of books that are geared for adults that are more current and were more in line with self-help/fiction that I threw in the garbage.  Each have been accepted by many as insightful, wonderful, godly, etc. and I thought they were both unbiblical (I’m no scholar) and twisted. The difference, if you ask me, is that the fantasy, fictional books are exactly what they say they are and if you don’t like that kind of thing then there’s no problem. You keep them out of your house, period.  I have more of a problem with the supposed Christian-labeled books that *seem* to protray the truth but under a trained eye they are twisting the truth. The young Christian may not be able to pick up on the false doctrine as soon as a seasoned Christian or maybe never. 

Personally, I would rather read what I know is fantasy and just accept that, then read what I think/believe is some form of the truth only to find out that the author doesn’t even believe in salvation by grace like I do.  Their view in many areas of life would be so different from mine if that were the case. 

I hope this all makes sense.  I guess you could say that I prefer not to be fooled or tricked having my own beliefs used as the resource.  That really makes me mad!  These books I’m reading right now are not labeled Power of a Praying Woman, Created to be His Helpmeet, etc.  They are exactly what they are, fiction.  They do not profess to be any more than that, at least they don’t on the cover or beginning pages.  The one’s that do profess to have the truth better have the truth, nothing more and nothing less, or they go in the garbage at my house.  Just mho

I personally don’t think I even need to read a book entitled The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardrobe to know it’s going to have the occult in it. 🙂 My original post said that I don’t allow books containing the occult in our home. I’ve read quotes from the Narnia book samples on books.google.com to know enough about it–that it not need be read in our home. As for Lewis, if a person says in his own writings that pagans are saved (and see other quotes above) then I believe it’s fair to say that person doesn’t believe in absolute truth from scriptures. I’m believing the quotes from Lewis’ books themselves and the Narnia book that are quoted online on books.google.com, not only from what K of the F said. But there website was a starting point for me to keep searching what Lewis was like.

I teach my children that if the bible says it’s wrong, it’s wrong, as I’m sure you do. And paganism is wrong and I feel it’s even wrong to read fantasy stories containing it. I even feel Dora the Explorer shows are wrong because there is a witch in them. 🙂

I shall bow out now. 

I’ve been reading the book titled “Gospel-Powered Parenting” which has been very insightful considering this current discussion. I’d like to share, as it confirms my own thoughts concerning the matter.

“….as parents it would be good to assume that a good offense is better than defense. Either we can focus on preparing our children to enter the world and conquer it, or we can concentrate on protecting our children from the world. A defensive mind-set worries about the evil influences of Halloween, Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, or non-Christians on the Little League Team. Although parenting always involves some protection, this should not be the main focus for biblical parenting.”

Does anyone feel that as parents, we need to have an offensive mind-set, assuming that our children need the overwhelming all-conquering power of the new birth and once they get it, its power will protect them from the world. “He who is greater in you, than he who is in the world” and “Everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world.”

Shouldn’t we focus on equipping our children to overcome the world- not by changing and controlling their environment as much as going after their hearts? Getting at their hearts by teaching the gospel, modeling it and centering our homes around it. Shouldn’t we focus on making Christ so attractive (first and foremost through our marriages) that the world cannot get a foothold in their hearts?

“….the best way to overcome the world is not with morality or self-discipline. Christians overcome the world by seeing the beauty and excellence of Christ. They overcome the world by seeing something more attractive than the world: Christ, “in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge” (Col. 2:3). A man who owns an Acura is not interested in a Geo Metro. In the same way, Christian parents try to make Christ and his kingdom glorious. Their children conquer the lusts of this world with a higher passion: the moral beauty of Christ.

……by contrast, defensive parents have little confidence in the attractiveness of the gospel. They think the world is more powerful. Fundamentally, they are not confident in the gospel’s power to transform their children from the inside out. They do not believe Jesus’ words. “Take heart; I have overcome the world” (John 16:33). They have little confidence in the world-conquering power of the new birth.”

I have to confess I’ve had more of a defensive-mindset over the past 15 years of being a parent, than offensive. However, now, I truly believe that we need to aim all our arrows at our children’s hearts knowing that once their hearts are changed (the power of the new birth), most of the battle will be won. Over the years I’ve had little confidence in conversion and sanctification in the hearts of my children and instead put more confidence in rules, restrictions and protections. My husband and I want to give our children tools to fight off the world’s allurements and do everything we can to make the gospel attractive, pursuing their hearts and not just protecting them from worldly influence.

This is such a weighty matter and one worthy of prayerful consideration…..

With love in Christ,

Heather