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Sharing narrations
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Sonya and SCM team – I know it would be difficult to impossible to comment on these narration examples but can you address the “setting of the bar” a little here? How are we to *know* or *measure* our children’s progress with CM narrations? Is it really as subjective as our own judgement? Should we seek out traditional rubrics and try to use them as a guide to measure or did Charlotte create a type of narration standard of performance or a rubric that we can use?
Thanks in advance for any clarity.
I have never seen a sample of how Charlotte corrected narrations. I don’t even know if any exist anymore. So I’m going off of her philosophical principles, explained methods, and (hopefully) common sense.
A few thoughts.
Remember that it’s a process. The goal is growth for each child as a person, as with any other school subject.
Customize any rubric you might find to best reflect your expectations at different stages.
Raising the bar includes asking for different types of narration as the children progress in their skill. Charlotte did this by varying how she asked the narration questions. Start with narrative (tell the story), then add in expository (explain how ___ works), then add descriptive (describe what __ looks like), and finally add persuasive (give your opinion and support it). If you analyze Charlotte’s narration questions, she made those transitions roughly at grades 1-3 (narrative), grades 4-6 (add expository), grades 7-9 (add descriptive), grades 10-12 (add persuasive).
Each of those narration types will lend itself to looking for/working on some specifics; for example, in a narrative you would work toward good sequencing of events, in an expository you would work toward covering all the key steps in a logical order, in descriptive you would work toward going from big-picture overview to smaller details, in persuasive you would work toward a clearly stated thesis and solid supporting points.
You will also have progress in punctuation, capitalization, spelling, and grammar to watch for. Those will remain constant no matter which narration type you are asking for. Here is a simple progression that you might use throughout the grade levels:
- Capitalization: beginning of each sentence, (once that is mastered) + proper names, + capitalization within dialogue
- Punctuation: end of each sentence, + dialogue punctuation, + clarifying commas and semicolons
- Spelling: improvement over time
- Grammar: sentence breaks, + verb tense consistent, + agreement, + pronoun usage, + paragraph breaks
So, yes, grading a composition is somewhat subjective, but it also has milestones that you can use as smaller goals along the way. Does that help any?
Yes! Thank you so much Sonya. That is just the advice I was seeking. I think I’ll take some time to formulate this in to a bookmark that I can keep handy to use when asking for and evaluating their narrations.
I know I’ve not been consistent in asking for those different types of narration but instead have defaulted more to the narrative mode too often. Sometimes I tend to think that narrative “tell all” is some form of measurement of reading comprehension or something but in reality the other types would do just as well to show that too.
Your CM wisdom and insight are totally awesome.
This was very helpful to me as well. I also seem to fall into asking for the narrative form as a default to often. Thank you, Sonya! I think I would also like to have this as some sort of handy, quick reference tool to use as needed (good idea, Claire). Maybe I will just print it out and put it into my homeschool teacher binder.
Having a Year 5 student, I feel like his narrations are really good. I haven’t really added in the “tell how ___ works” type of narrations. I can see how that would be a great addition for our science narrations (Tell how the skeleton gives the body shape OR tell how the circulatory system works”, but how do you incorporate that type narration for history readings?
Oh, to have your confidence Lindsey!
I’m afraid I am always wondering the answer to the age old question: “Are they where they should be?” Or better yet “What is “where they should be” anyway?”For me, the narrative form of narration is a way to check that they have completely read or fully grapsed or attentively listened to the reading/lesson. That’s not exactly true to CM. It should be more about accepting that what they may take away from a lesson as their own experience with the material (provided it’s of a certain level I suppose.) The other questions, of course, would also answer that completeness issue but add more age appropriate complexity too.
Here’s a stab at your question Lindsey … “tell how Rome advanced into Asia minor and established Greece and Macedonia as its eastern provinces” … just a quick thought.
One thing that needles me is that if they were to answer that Science question about the bones, wouldn’t that be pretty short and sweet? I guess that’s ok too, huh?
Thank you, Claire. I’m not always confident that we are where others are–but I do believe we are where we need to be. I know that I work very hard to plan our year, buy the best living books I can, take opportunities to go on field trips or watch good movies, connect with others, and ask for help when I need it. And of course PRAY. That’s about all anyone can do, right? If I do all that and still don’t have confidence in myself, then my lack of confidence something I need to take to the Lord.
I agree with you about the narrative form being hte most comprehensive way of seeing if they actually “got” what was read. I am learning to allow their history narrations to come out later, during play, for example. Many scenes from Jamestown or the Pilgrims landing at Plymouth have been built and re-enacted with Legos this year, so I don’t stress too much when they don’t give a stellar narration during school time.
Yes, science answers are short and sweet, in my experience. I have found that it lengthens as their interest in a particular subject grows. They want to know more, research more, read more–and then tell more.
You’re right that some types of narration will lend themselves easier to certain subjects or certain books. You don’t want to do one type exclusively; just keep an eye open for good opportunities to use any of the other types that are age appropriate. The expository works nicely with some science or nature study (Tell how the hive is set up.) books. Descriptive works well for geography books. You may find other opportunities too, depending on the chapters as you come across them. A mixture is best.
Re: My CONFIDENCE regarding their educaitons. Point well taken Lindsey!
Yes, I agree many things come out in play and in daily life and I too consider those part of the totality of their narration on a particular book.
A quick follow up … Inconsistency in narration must have been an issue since the beginning of time, right? So how did Charlotte handle that in her schools? I understand it’s a habit training issue. I’ve dealt with it various ways over the years but primarily by looking over their written narration with them in a sort of “grand discussion” time to say gently “do you think this is your best work today?” or something along those lines which usually is all it takes and I’ll get a voluntary request to redo that particular narration or an understanding of what is expected of the narrations in general. (This happened with my son’s narrations I shared on this post, in fact.)
I have realized that poor narrations are essentially busy work. There is nothing to them … lots of filler sentences, subjective thoughts of the student, etc. Therefore they are wasted time with the material. I’m trying to make a point, as the children are older and busier and ready to “be done” quicker every day, that the richness and the purpose of a narration is to complete the circular relationship with the material – to make it ones own. Seeing it that way has helped curb this habit here. I wondered if anyone else handles this differently?
One more question comes to mind here … Do you ask a specific narration question for each reading based on that reading? Or do the students have a list (similar to the bookmarks circulated, or the SCM site suggested narration methods page) from which they choose their own narration method?
I have a “narration” that I’d like some comments on. I’d like to know some basic things – for instance, is the follow “enough”? Or should she have gone into more detail?
I asked my 5th grader – If you were going to interview a character from _Twice Freed_ by Patricia St. John, who would it be? Why would you choose that character? What 4 questions would you ask him/her?
Her answer:
It would probably be Archippus. The reason I would pick him is because he is closer to my age.
The questions:
-What was it like to see Paul face to face?
-Did Onesimus do anything anytime for you?
-What was it like to have someone wait on you?
– Why did you try to keep Onesimus away from Irene?
-Could you tell Irene didn’t like you as much as she liked Onesimus?
-Did you like Irene, or were you only trying to keep Onesimus away from her?
I was concerned with her third question – the one about what was it like to have someone wait on you. I haven’t read Twice Freed, so I really don’t know the story. But typically, when there’s a servant involved, the person being served lets the read know whether it’s nice or whether it’s a bother.
I did think her last three questions showed that she’s starting to get to that age of “Drama” and “liking” boys. *L* How fast they grow!!!
Any thoughts or advice?? I’m looking for ways I can improve – not necessarily ways for my daughter to improve (although those thoughts are welcome, too!).
Thanks!
Karen, I’m also not familiar with Twice Freed.
However, I do have sample narrations from our children’s work on our blog, including some photos. You can view them here…
http://reflectionsfromdrywoodcreek.blogspot.com/search/label/Narration
The samples are mixed from dd during 4th & 5th grade and ds during 3rd & 4th grade.
I love the “Soo they fell in L-O-V-E!!!” part!
I’m afraid I am always wondering the answer to the age old question: “Are they where they should be?” Or better yet “What is “where they should be” anyway?”
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