OK so my older boys in 6th & 5th grade were doing great last year with Queens LL and loving it (as much as they can be) then this year we switched to JAG and they are HATING IT. They don’t understand it.
Now no one can say for sure what our kids in 6/5th grade will do with there future but I don’t see them as needing grammar as a main focus. That said:
Could I just continue with LL through high school and still get all they would need if they choose to attend college? Will it be enough?
Your thoughts and comments please! MistyCindie2ddsMember
I am really interested to hear what others have to say. We have really enjoyed them over the last year and have no plans to change.
Misty, IMO it depends. What might they want to study in college? What sort of a college? Most colleges are going to require a minimum of two years of a foreign language. They will need enough grammar knowledge to be able to study another language that long. They also need to be able to write well enough not to make the professors cringe (so should understand things like correct word usage, parallel structure, correct punctuation, etc.) If they don’t have that, they will need help from the student help center to be able to write successfully on a college level. Either that or take a lot of bad grades on papers.
I haven’t followed the Queens series high enough up to know if they address those sorts of things or not. My personal choice is a few years of Latin instruction—that will get anyone enough grammar to get by just fine in English. We just do a quick brush-up on usage and punctuation in junior high, because all the real, heavy-duty grammar they are getting in Latin, French and Spanish. My fourth year and up in French were what taught me English grammar. I know it sounds odd to say, but that’s what did it for me. 🙂
An alternative thing, if you wanted to continue with Queens, would be to simply purchase an English handbook for high school ages, and just pick out a topic a week, say, and learn about it, then do the next one, etc. And then you’ll be getting some more if you do a good solid two or so years with a foreign language. That’ll help a lot. You’ll HAVE to understand about direct objects and transitive verbs and all that if you study another language. No way around it.
So I think there can be more than one good route to competent English writing. There ARE some things you have to know, though, or be marked by the professors and TA’s as semi-literate. I know it sounds awful. It’s just the way the world works in academia. You are judged on how you write. I often tell parents they would be horrified if they could hear their kids’ college professors talking about them. Sigh.
Thanks for the reply Bookworm! You always come through. Though you have totally scared me about my kids going to college. I have no idea what any of that means , also we decided to do sign language. Will that count for a foreign language?
So does anyone know if LL will cover the things that Michelle mentioned? Can it be done through there books? Thanks MistyMissy OHParticipant
This is just my personal opinion! You can check out the scope and sequence for each Langauage Lessons level on the Queen’s website.
I do not think Queen Language Lessons have enough grammar in the upper levels. I would want to add a grammar program around highschool. Our family didn’t like Analytical Grammar, but we are having success with Easy Grammar w/ my 9th grade son.
Sorry……I do like Queens Language Lessons other than the lack of grammar in the highschool levels.
Sign language will count as a foreign language at some colleges. It will not at others.
Do try to do your best and not panic. There is ALWAYS the possibility to begin college at a community college, which takes some of the pressure off of you. It would be easy to do a foreign language and some other things there, and then transfer later to a four-year college if that is what fits your children’s needs the best. We are kind of wound tight here, because my oldest turns 17 today, and he has not only college but grad school in his sights, and he has big dreams, big ambitions, and wants to go to a serious school. 🙂 All of mine are probably aiming at a four-year college right off the bat, which means I need to really have my ducks in a row, and it makes me a little tense at times. 🙂 I’ve been known to lie in bed twitching at night wondering if we are really nailing down calculus or if we need a tutor (preferably a free one, lol!) and we are waiting on tenterhooks for his PSAT scores to get back. 🙂 I don’t want to infect anyone else with the disease, lol, so relax, take a deep breath, and prayerfully do your best. If you really want to go back to Queens, then do it. I still think the idea of a basic handbook might not be a bad idea–you and your children could use it as a reference without making much more “work”. Let me know if you need some ideas if you want to think about doing that.
Isn’t that odd? My picture used to be on, but it has disappeared and now I am a generic silhouette. Now how did the forum software know I had been putting on weight and no longer look like my picture????Nedra in So. CAMember
I am using Queen’s LL with a high schooler. I love it and believe it is enough. But I am not one to believe a heavy grammar program is necessary all 4 years of high school. My kids use Queen’s from the beginning, so when they arrive in the high school years they already have a good grip on grammar and do not need to continue repeating it. The Queen’s high school books focus on writing through dictation, copywork, and essay.
Thanks everyone.. so some say it’s enough others say it’s not enough? Well,,, now I really have to think this through more.
Bookworm.. where did you go?? Yeh, you wouldn’t want to see my picture either! But.. what books would you recommend to add for grammar? Any thoughts would be great.
Misty, perhaps you may be interested in Nancy Wilson’s Our Mother Tongue instead. Plus, it’s not too late to start your children on a Latin program.
As for how much, I think a lot depends upon the direction your child is headed, vocation-wise, and your personal expectations of your children-what you consider to be valuable and what one thinks is a well-rounded education. I also think it’s prudent to have an idea of what the colleges expect, because that’s what they are going to be dealing with eventually, no matter what our personal opinions are; if their professor requires that they know this material, then it’s only responsible for us to prepare them.
Rachel can you tell me more about OMT? What would I start them in latin?
Misty, Our Mother Tongue is what I use for a quick brush-up in junior high. I have heard from several people who did not find it in-depth or explanatory enough for children/families that were not very familiar with grammar. It was really just a review for my children and worked very well for that. It is inexpensive and quick, but does sort of assume that you know some things already, and that your child won’t need much practice.
I was thinking maybe a basic handbook like the Rod and Staff English Handbook would be good if you wanted to use it as a reference, and then to choose rules/etc. to discuss and apply towards the writing they are doing with Queens. It would be simple to do.
I second the idea to think about Latin. IMO it’s the easiest foreign language to teach in a homeschool. And it’s PERFECT for nailing down English grammar. In fact, the grammarians of long ago made up some of the “rules” of English to make English more like Latin (for example, the rules on not splitting infinitives–impossible in Latin! and the ones on not ending sentences with prepositions) In our home, we use Latin in the Christian Trivium–don’t let that panic you, there’s no real “trivium” going on, it’s just based on the Latin Bible instead of on, say , Caesar’s writings or Cicero’s. But after hearing from Sonya how much she liked it, I started my youngest this year in Getting Started with Latin, and it’s working very well as a gentle beginning for him. He was really intimidated by his older brothers, who are very odd and like to actually CONVERSE in Latin, and didn’t want to start learning Latin yet, but GSWL has sort of broken him in gently. When we are done with that, we’ll leap right into the first volume of Latin in the Christian Trivium.Rachel WhiteParticipant
For Latin, if you want the Ecclessiastical propnunciation you can do either Latina Christiana 1 or First Form Latin: http://www.memoriapress.com/descriptions/index_latin.htm There are othere posts in the past about each of these, I’d recommend you search for; you could also search on the computer for other’s opinions on the classical boards, too.
For classical Latin, Latin for Children:http://classicalacademicpress.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=13
There are others outlined and reviewed here:http://www.homeschoolchristian.com/curricula/reviews/latincomparison.php
These three are different from each other, so gather as much about them as you can to make the best decision on what’s best for your children. After much research, I’m choosing Latin for Children for my 10 yr. old. For Lang. Arts. he’s in ILL now, then he’ll move into Our Mother Tongue in 2 years. Here’s a review of it:http://www.exodusbooks.com/details.aspx?id=5245 you can also go to Amazon and look at samples. When I looked at the samples, I liked it. I think Bookworm used OMT, too. I don’t know how much they’ve had in the Queens up till now (never used Queens) to determine if he would be ready for OMT, but I like the approach of OMT better than JAG. Perhaps determining exactly what they’re not getting would be helpful in determining what they’re missing and what therefore what they need. Perhaps this is a good opportunity? Perhaps they liked Queens precisely because it was too easy? Just throwing out some ideas.
Thanks everyone I finally had time to read the replys with the snow blizzard here today!
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