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Unschooling and CM

(11 posts) (9 voices)

Started 11 months ago by Sue
Latest reply from my3boys

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Sue
Member

I was wondering if some of you incorporate some aspects of CM methods with unschooling, and if so, how you go about it.

I am pondering this because, looking back on this year, I see instances where we have strayed off my scheduled CM path toward what could be considered unschooling--at least for some subjects. We do need to establish and maintain a routine of sorts for my autistic son to thrive, but he tends to be very interest-led when it comes to choosing library books or activities. I'm just wondering if I can mesh the two homeschool methods in an effective way as I plan our next academic year....

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
amandajhilburn
Member

I could be wrong here...so others will hopefully jump in and correct me, but I think the fact that CM schools were using short lessons and had afternoons free would give you the best of both worlds.

You'd have a routine and scheduled lessons 1/2 of the day and time for the children to pursue their own interests the other 1/2 of the day :)

This is what usually happens at our house, anyway. I also let the kids choose library books on whatever subjects they are interested in along with books that we need for our regular studies.

Just my opinion, of course.

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
Tecrz1
Member

To me the philosophy of unschooling is at odds with the CM foundation of habit training. I think the concept of delight directed studies might be a more accurate description of what I feel CM recommended. The point of short lessons was to give children plenty of living ideas and necessary skills while still leaving afternoons for the things the students wanted to learn.
I encourage my children to follow areas of interest, but I do not leave their education to only the things they happen to like. I feel like the CM concept of introducing new ideas through a structured curriculum gives birth to many interests and areas of education my children would have never found on their own. The key is to not be so structured that those things that grab onto our children and beckon them to go deeper get pushed aside in favor of keeping pace with a lesson plan.
Whatever you call it, letting a child follow their interests is very CM to me. It is kind of difficult to plan for though. You never know what might start a fire. Not packing your schedule too full so you can be flexible might be a food place to start. I also ask my children what topics they might be interested in for different subjects. When my daughter was interested in wildflowers I got her a field guide and let her focus on that for nature study, although my son prefers bugs, frogs, and snakes.
One thing we do is let each child pick a topic, then go to the library and get some books on it, then they can add notebook pages about it as they want to. My son did this with flags. He has page after page of drawings of flags from around the world. He did this in the afternoons, after school was finished, though. Math must still go on :-)
I think keeping a schedule is wise, but so is following interest. They can coincide if we are flexible.
Tara

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
Sue
Member

I used to equate unschoolers with being free spirits, almost rebelling against rules and society. This never seemed to sit well with my traditional religious upbringing....after all, I reasoned, God is a God of order, right?

Having thought more about that over the past several years, I have come to realize that, while orderliness is of value, God does not desert us in the midst of our disorders. If that were the case, then I'd have to believe there is no hope for our special kids who live with diagnosed disorders every day. So, God is in all things, and I need not fear a method of schooling that seems lacking order; I just have to make certain that I am following God's order of things if I utilize such a method (or portions of it).

So, I would have to respectfully say that I don't think unschooling is necessarily at odds with CM habit training, for I have known unschooling families whose houses are fairly tidy (and regularly maintained that way), the children are well-disciplined, and there is even a schedule of some sort for completing schoolwork. However, it is not necessarily unschooling as an entire method that interests me--perhaps just the notion of incorporating some of the student-led methods of bringing about education. I suppose I am just wondering what that looks like for those who utilize unschooling for at least part of their family's education.

I know, for one thing, that I like using history modules to define what time period we will be studying, but I can see choosing living science books based more on what interests the children. It could work out differently for each family, and of course, if you are purchasing (for example) Apologia texts (instead of completely relying on living books) for a given year's science work, you would have to purchase that and pretty much stick with it (unless you have lots of money and are comfortable with purchasing a different text mid-year....uh, no....not us! No money tree in our backyard, lol!)

I think, for the most part, I am pondering how to best handle those short lessons for my son who has a lower I.Q. and autism, and how to best motivate my dreamy, artistic daughter, while getting everything in that my just-beginning-high school daughter will have to accomplish more independently. Meshing it all together seems a little daunting at times.

I like the approach Tara has to allowing her children to pursue their interests, and Amanda, you're right about getting the routine things done in the morning to allow for interest-led activities in the afternoon. Unfortunately, what I've seen a lot of is either A) we get a late start (for a variety of reasons) and don't finish until mid- or late-afternoon, or B) we get done early enough but all they want to do is go off and engage in rather mindless activities. I'm hoping to introduce more handicrafts this summer. We do have regular library days, and I've begun to notice that they choose books on a certain topic of interest, so that is a good sign!

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
sheraz
Member

I think that when people mention unschooling to me, my first reaction is to kind of snort and think no way...because I am not a personality type that can handle disorder. However. When I get past the name itself "unschooling" and think about what unschoolers mean when they say that...I think that interest led learning happens a lot in our homes whether we think of it that way or not. What of all the posts of "my daughter wants to read, or spell correctly in her letters, or my son has read every book in the library on space". That IS interest based learning.

Interest lead learning does not have to equate chaos in the home with filthy dishes and lazy disobedient children. LOL You still need structure and direction within interest led learning. In many ways I think to be sucessful at unschooling, a person would have to be more involved with their children then even many of us are on a daily basis in order to facilitate the learning materials and knowledge needed for a vast variety of subjects. It easier to choose a list of books and schedule those over a year than I think it would be to truly unschool, and I have to admit that I would not be happy unschooling because I am a control freak and like my shedules and planning. =)

Having said that, I fail to see why you can't incorporate some of interest lead learning into your day, by letting your son help select the delivery method of his instruction by choosing the way it comes to him. At that point I think more like topical studies within the framework of chosen courses of study...math has to be done daily, but say you are in Ancient Egypt, and your son is fascinated with the pyramids. By letting him choose books about this subject, I think that you could choose a copywork and dictation passage, the history about the subject, BOC entries, the science involved, etc and still use CM methods in the "delivery". None of us are perfect, none of us are CM police, and none of us know your son the way you do. If combining these methods will help your son succeed, go for it!

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
TX-Melissa
Member

Mary Hood would be a good one to read for that. She is often pegged as an unschooler, although she doesn't describe herself that way. It was in her books where I first was introduced to Charlotte Mason. She has written several books, but The Relaxed Home School would be the one that describes how she educated her children - each very different in personality and learning style. Her website is archersforthelord.org. A couple of her other books are geard toward encouraging and spurring on we homeschooling mammas. She definately has a heart for us, even though she's done with her own kids. :)

HTH,

Melissa

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
Tukata
Member

I had two thoughts as I read your posts.

First, if you haven't read The Heart of Wisdom Teaching Approach, you probably should! (Or poke around her website). Heartofwisdom.com, I believe. She combines CM, Unit studies, and delight-directed lessons. I know that Unit Studies and CM are in conflict with each other (per CM's writings on unit studies), but I do think she definitely has a valid approach. One other aspect I like about Heart of Wisdom is her emphasis on Bible first. The first part of the school day is Bible study, the second part is other studies. Anyway, I actually stick closer to CM, but I know just reading the Heart of Wisdom has influenced our homeschool for the better...especially about putting more emphasis on Bible. And it has shown me how to help my children pursue their own interests at the appropriate times, without them taking control of the homeschool.

The second thought comes from my favorite homeschooling website other than SCM: http://www.lifestyle-homeschool.com

She also blogs at: http://livelifewithyourkids.wordpress.com

She gives her children what she calls "productive free time" in the afternoon. They are free to pursue their own interests, but must be productive. When they are little and learning how to do this, she works with them at putting together a schedule and deciding what and how to pursue their interests. This is not at all chaotic disorder...but they are learning how to pursue the things they are interested in.

Anyway, I am probably not doing a good job explaining either website I gave you, but I really think they could speak into your situation. Hope they will help and hope I have not totally confused you!

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
my3boys
Member

I don't see any reason why you could not combine the two (or three, if you wanted to) methods, since it is *your* home school (and of course you know that). I think unschooling, much like CM, much like home schooling in general is misunderstood or ill-perceived based on people we know who do "such and such." Each family, even CMers, do things in their own way, as unschoolers do. I have read quite a bit about unschooling and have no doubt that those that pursue that educational style are convinced it works, just like I believe the CM way (as best as we can do it) is the best for us. What I do think does happen at times is, when you try to mesh two fairly different methods that you often find that one is in complete conflict with the other, then you have those "Ah ha" moments. You may find that one is really the better for your family/situation or that you can find benefits of the two and it will work out okay. I did find that when I was trying to follow two different methods that I was pulled (in my mind) with the choices and ideas behind them. *I* had to choose one for our academics, and that's CM.

In some ways, I see all families *unschooling* or *child-directed* learners when they pursue their interests. But I also know that just by doing home work with your child would not mean that you are home schooling. True unschoolers have a mind-set, like CMers, that has taken time, alot of reading, mulling over the ideas to really understand the method/lifestyle. I have thought about it alot, not to live that way, but just to understand the ideas...and I get it to a degree. But just like home schooling, it takes a lot of faith/work on the parents' part (just like CM families) to go against the norm and completely embrace the method. And, everyone feels their way is the best way, which is how we should feel. If you don't have faith or a sense of peace in what you are doing then it may be time to look elsewhere. I feel CM gives me exactly what I'm looking for, but that's just me.

I have no idea if that helped or muddied the waters.

Best wishes as you work out what is best for your family.

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
LDIMom
Member

I often say we are ecclectic in our homeschool. Truth is, my home is sort of too in regards to "style" (I don't have one LOL!), menu planning (varies greatly week to week), my clothing (depends largely on hand-me-downs from my generous sister!), etc.

Back to homeschooling, we incorporate a lot of CM into our school (love living books) and we are serious about chores and try to work on habit training. But I also tend to allow a lot of delight-directed learning. For instance, oldest DS is working now on Star Rank in Boy Scouts. He has every intention of achieving Eagle Scout rank. So, he does do a lot of work on Merit Badges, and I let him choose on that. If it coincides well with a particular area we are studying, great, but if not, that is OK too. He is learning and growing and using his mind and body.

He also loves to read about World War II, and not so much about ancient history. He is VERY excited we are moving into Module 5, but he did read all of his assigned books this last year for Module 4 (about 6). Still, when he has free reading (still needs to be non-twaddle), he loves to read about World War II (namely biographies or autobiographies), and I figure this is not a bad thing.

I guess we are a mixture of CM, unschooling, and I don't know what else! It all works and they are learning, so I keep telling msyelf we are doing a lot right.

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
jmac17
Member

I think the two approaches are definitely related. I've been reading several books by John Holt and John Tayler Gatto lately. Both have influenced the unschooling movement in major ways. If I understand correctly, John Holt coined the term unschooling and got the whole thing started. I've been struck by how similar their underlying philosophies are to Charlotte Mason's. I believe, for example, that the unschoolers would agree with CM's concept of the child as a person. They also feel that children need opportunities to make their own connections with ideas and the world around them. They are highly critical of the public school system's focus on tests and grades, saying that it creates an adversarial relationship between the teacher and student that impedes or prevents any real learning. CM advocated 'exams', but they were very different than the exams that you find in the school system. CM's exams are simply an opportunity for the student to demonstrate all that they have learned, as opposed to tests that require specific answers that are either right or wrong.

The difference, of course, is how CM and the unschoolers approach education based on the underlying philosophies, even though they have similar reasons for what they do. For CM her understanding of children produced a structured method that lays out a tremendous feast of ideas for children to choose from and digest. The unschoolers do basically the same thing in a less structured way, allowing their children access to ideas and opportunities and letting them choose what to focus on and which 'rabbit trails' to follow.

I've chosen to use CM's approach because I think it is an effective way of introducing ideas and concepts and giving the students tools to integrate them into their own understanding of the world. If we were unschooling, I would wonder if we were missing something. If my children are never exposed to Shakespeare, or Ancient Greek societies, or the order of rodents (the three subjects DD enjoys most at present,) how will they know if they are interested in those things?

So, I think of our homeschool as 'relaxed Charlotte Mason'. For example, I don't know whether we are doing a 4 year or 6 year history cycle or something else entirely. We are going to spend as much time in each period as we like. We did the equivalent of SCM's Module 1 (Egypt) in about 7 months, and are now doing Greece. When we finish the books we are currently reading, we'll decide whether to continue on with Greece and find a few more, or whether we want to move forward. If something sparks an interest, we'll expand on it, find some more living books, and feast there for a while.

We are, however, using all the tools such as narration, living books, nature study, short lessons, copywork, dictations, etc. that Charlotte taught.

Isn't the freedom of homeschooling wonderful?

Joanne

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post
my3boys
Member

I think I read an article here on SCM that gives an Unschooling vs. CM, it was interesting and pretty much summed up what I already knew.

My personal opinion is that every home schooler/CMer/unschooler/eclectic hser/classical hser, and so on, has their own idea, in some way, of what that means to them. I have read about "extreme" unschooling, Christian unschooling, and everything in between and they are seem to have a common theme, but their everyday lives look very different. Even the ones that claim the same name sound a bit different in how they approach practically everything. Even though all of us who home school using CM's ideas are doing things a bit differently at home, primarily because of the interests of our dc...our days look different, as they should.

Posted 11 months ago # Report Post

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